S.F.A.R. Field Rules

Greetings all!

That's why some games are being played semi auto inside the building, so far it has worked out well. We all have to try our best when judging close range shots as respect to the players. I know this topic has come up several times in the past and I don't think the high FPS is going away anytime soon. And the BS happens everywhere airsoft is played unless it's a regulated tournament. I think more and more players are getting used to the way we play at S.F.A.R. These guns do hurt at close range all I ask is for everyone to used their best judgment concerning the distance before you light someone up. And I also think it's a little harder to try not to hit someone in the face inside due to the poor visibility and light conditions at times, but close range face shots are not acceptable and no excuse unless they are inside a room looking out a window and shot from a distance and not 10-30 ft. If you can't hit a player in the body area from 10-30 feet you need to really work on your shooting skills.

The S.F.A.R. is where the big boys play and run together.

Regards,
NOBODY

You could have not said it better. Look no one likes to get hit in the face i have not yet and would not like it but in the building if your only sticking your head and gun out of a room window ect thats the place where your most likely to get hit and the people that get shot inside the building are almost always shot from the oppisite side of the building and with semi-auto how we did this weekend really worked out and everyone enjoyed it so im hoping we dont have any problems this sunday

But if you do happen to get hit in the face like NOBODY said this is where the big boys play so you just got to take it like a man like everyone that has got hit in the face before. The person apoligizes and maybe a little bandage and your in the next game

I think it was not well understood my point. Let me say here for those who does not know much about Airsoft Guns because obviously their saying something totally wrong. " Lipo batteries does not matter when it come to FPS, only to rate of fire, FPS is only dictated by the spring, barrel and cylinder. " And I agreed with some of the guys here if you dont play Airsoft most likely you wont get hit in the face, but if you do just expect that maybe one day you will get hit, and to that effect I think in S.F.A.R. we have seen two incidents, the one with the kid and guess what the other one was me http://www.flickr.com/photos/46787927@N04/4346967775/sizes/o/in/set-72157623374094754/

And you dont see me complaining about it, I just know that have to be more careful and that's it. ManUp and lets have fun.

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im sorry but higher fps has nothing to do with range...you want range then get a better hopup.

Lets study that for a sec. FPS? Feet Per Second !!! Isn't that range? And let me tell you, I own a chrono, and please I've spend money in this hobby and a better hopup will be a Polar Star Concave Hop (like this one)
http://www.airsoftgi.com/product_info.php?cPath=31_170&products_id=6446 , and I have it in all my guns, and do you know what happen when you give too much hopup, the FPS will go down, just ask me when you see me to chrono any gun compare to no hopup, and with it all the way up. So the more hopup the less range and that's for sure.

AGREED


Thank you Toletero for showing us you are living proof of someone that has gotten shoot in the face and has been a man about it.

Toletero wrote:

Lets study that for a sec. FPS? Feet Per Second !!! Isn't that range? And let me tell you, I own a chrono, and please I've spend money in this hobby and a better hopup will be a Polar Star Concave Hop (like this one)
http://www.airsoftgi.com/product_info.php?cPath=31_170&products_id=6446 , and I have it in all my guns, and do you know what happen when you give too much hopup, the FPS will go down, just ask me when you see me to chrono any gun compare to no hopup, and with it all the way up. So the more hopup the less range and that's for sure.

If I may add to this. Being a sniper I had to do a lot of research on this topic. FPS (Feet Per Second) defines a unit of speed, where as range defines a unit of distance. The hop up unit, when adjusted on the up position will add backspin to the BB when in flight, what this will do is lift the BB up while moving forward, this in turn will raise the arch of the BB. Thus carrying it further than normal. If the hop up is low the BB will not travel as far Now yes, FPS does affect range...to a point, but you will lose accuracy. Having an upgraded hop up unit, not just the spacer (but that is a very helpful piece..especially that one Toletero) will improve the range along with a tightbore barrel more than you can imagine. Especially better than getting stronger spring. If you put in lighter BBs you lose accuracy. It's a known fact. Yes you will lose some FPS adjusting the hop up but only a few FPS that is not too big of a difference.

Now like I stated, Im a sniper, I dont know jack about how batteries affect any of this, but I know the physics part to let you know that the FPS does not affect the range like you think. I see no point of an AEG having to shoot more than 400fps to be honest. They hurt enough when shot no matter what the range.

We have an area we play in, small as can be, and there is a "house" area. When in that area all players must switch to semi auto. Some guns come high out of the box like Echo 1 so you adapt to these things.

One of the ways we have dealt with people who dont call hits is the entire teams turns and lights that entire area up. You just stop, get all comms up and tell where that person is and everyone fires that way. Im sure as some point he will call it. It works really really....really well.

It's confusing, but when you think about it, it's just simple physics.

How about to wear some sort of face protection? No matter what FPS, shot in the face will be painful.

Wow !!! Well I think that we are going some where else with this point. But FPS does not defined unit per second, it defined Feet Per Second, that's how a BBs will travel if it in a straight line, I dont know for you guys but for me Feet is distance, and yes the hopup will make the bbs go straight is posible, and you say

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what this will do is lift the BB up while moving forward, this in turn will raise the arch of the BB. Thus carrying it further than normal

If you are really trying to do that the bb will go up in an arch like you said and eventually will fall with less distance. See the point here is this, Hopup will not dictated the distance that a bb will travel only the FPS. Now lets talk about physics, I was a baseball player back in my days, lets talk about pitchers, Fast ball and curve balls, there is a different in the two, one is that the curve ball have more spin on the ball than the fastball, now fastballs are faster than the curve balls aren't they? I've never seen a curve ball at 95 MPH, in fact if you ever play ball, did you know that by putting a little of saliva on the ball where there's no stitches, and throw it is hard is you can will go even faster, the only problem with this is that you dont know where is ball is going to end up, and do a little bit of research on this and you will see that is prohibited is baseball if a pitcher is seen putting saliva on the ball, and what I mean by this is that the less spin on the ball the further will travel, the more power behind any moving object the further will travel. And come on, did you ever open a AEG gearbox? what give the back spin to the bb is the spacer. The rest of the stuff is for you to dial the hopup or the spacer into the barrel or out of the barrel, and by dialing in and out is only a latch on top of the spacer that push the spacer in, that's is it, there's no better hopup, better quality maybe, but will do the same.

PS. And I think if someone is afraid of the Airsoft Sport because it may hurt, just don't play Airsoft becuase it hurts, just play with water guns. Not intended to insult anybody here, but I am tire hearing people complaint about FPS, that they dont call their hits, Just play and that's it. Like I said before we not here to really save the world.

This is my first post on this forum as I would like to put my 2 cents on the subject. I have owned over 16 different airsoft guns over the past three years and upgraded various others as well.

**Please note that I am not trying to tell you how to play, at what velocity to play at, or what to do. I haven't probably even met more than a handful of you. I am just trying to sort out how the airsoft guns function in terms of how to get the greatest potential. I however do believe in the rule that if the rifle shoots in excess of 400 fps, it should be used with caution and semi-automatic only as treated like an DMR. We all go to the fields for fun, and fun doesn't need to have pain attached as a side effect.

Feet-Per-Second is a unit of measure in that it measures the velocity an object. It can also dictate the distance an object travels.

True: The range and FPS of an airsoft gun have a direct correlation. For example, a 500 fps will outrange a 380 fps. But many other factors coincide with this. A higher FPS gives you a longer range, but dimishes the EFFECTIVE range that many airsofters strive for.

For instance, what is the point of having a 500 fps gun to hit someone at 200 feet if the bbs cannot be targeted to him. You can make the bb reach out there, but you cannot seem to hit the target as the are innaccurate.

Mr. Toletero:

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And come on, did you ever open a AEG gearbox? what give the back spin to the bb is the spacer. The rest of the stuff is for you to dial the hopup or the spacer into the barrel or out of the barrel, and by dialing in and out is only a latch on top of the spacer that push the spacer in, that's is it, there's no better hopup, better quality maybe, but will do the same.

Technically the hop-up nub touches the bucking which in turn puts the adequate pressure on the bb when firing. And "the rest of the stuff" such as the gearbox has an immense part as well. If you have poor compression then you will have poor consistency when attempting to hit your target. The seal between the piston head, cylinder, cylinder headm and the air nozzle is EXTREMELY important in an airsoft gun.

If you want to take down physics to Real Steel terms, than compare airsoft guns to smooth-bore muskets and airsoft guns with hop-up to rifled-barreled firearms. NO MATTER how much black powder you load into the musket, the rifled barrel will out shoot you, why? The rifling puts a spin onto the bullet just like hop-up does to an airsoft pellet. It creates what is called the Magnus Effect in which the the projectile is caught in a pocket of air created by the spin on the projectile as seen in the image below.


Here are some suggestions that would increase the effective range of an airsoft gun:

-Heavier BBs

Heavier bbs will go at a lower velocity, but they retain their mass and remain more accurate at farther distances since they are less affected by winds and other external factors. For instance, an AEG shooting a .2g bb at 400 fps will travel a smaller distance than the same rifle shooting the .25g which would travel at about 360 fps then.

-New hop-up bucking

There are two types of buckings, hard and soft, and each has its own affect on the bb. It is suggested that if your rifle is shooting over 400 fps, a hard bucking is the better choice as it will provide the right surface for the faster projectile. If under 400 fps, a soft bucking is recommended. **A soft bucking can be used in a 400+ fps rifle, but they will not last no where near as long as a hard bucking at those velocities.

-Hop-up Nub (SCS or Polar Star Concave Nub as they are called now)

The hop-up nub is what shapes the bucking when the bb travels through the hop-up chamber. Some people prefer the Concave nub as it shapes to the bb, some prefer the H-nub, and some prefer the stock nub which when broken in correctly can shape to the bb after many rounds are fired.

**The concave nub and systema bucking have proven the best combination from various testing.

-Tightbore barrel

The tighter the bore, the more long-term accuracy the bb will retain. It is also the quality of the barrel. Stock inner barrels from Clone companies and even reputable airsoft companies cannot match up to the aftermarket quality of a tightbore barrel. The tightbore barrel creates less space for the bb to move around in and therefore created smaller groupings when tested.

There is a tightbore barrel on the market by the name of a TK Twist barrel which has bore/rifling inside that leads to great accuracy for a low powered AEG. A stock TM at 280 fps with a TK twist barrel will get an effective range of over 150ft which is amazing for that low of an FPS. The air behind the bb in the barrel travels around the bb in the grooves to create a cushion of air so the bb doesn't hit the barrel as it is leaving, but rather stays in the middle of the barrel and floats to the target.

-New Cylinder Set/Piston head (For improved compression and consistency)

A new cylinder set can improve the compression of an airsoft gun by creating a better seal than the stock cylinder set. This will lead to improved accuracy/consistency when firing your airsoft replica.

-New Hop-up Chamber

Some say this is a waste of money but it is not. Stock hop-up chambers are usually a plastic two-piece hop-up chamber that may have compression issues out of the box. They also experience other poor craftsmanship such as poor materials where the chamber will adjust itself as you shoot your rifle. This is poor in design and a new aftermarket chamber can fix these issues. The aftermarket hop-up chambers such as the King Arms chambers are made as a one piece chamber, out of metal, and designed with the correct dimensions where it stays consistent when fired. This is of great importance.

Before the advent of Automatic Electric Guns (AEGs), there were what we call now Classic Airsoft Guns. They are powered by external air tanks and lack hop-up. However, they had what what called a LRB (Long Range Barrel) which was designed to put a backspin on the bb as it left the tip of the barrel. With an LRB, a classic airsoft gun could shoot out to 300 ft at about 350 fps.

However, as the 90's progressed and the economy took a dump in Japan, many of the classic airsoft gun companies closed their doors. Then Tokyo Marui came around with their Automatic Electric Guns which used hop-up rather than LRB's to create range.

A combination of velocity and accuracy upgrades will get you GREAT range, but velocity upgrades will just get you increased range but poor accuracy at thos eincreased ranges.

I am sure that I have left something out with this long post or I made need to clarify certain things, but just post up then in a response. Please do not flame with stupid accusations, but in a professional manner as all airsoft players should present themselves as.

Thanks in advanced,
ACE

EDIT: To touch up on an earlier subject. The voltage or type of battery doesn't determine the velocity or distance of the airsoft, but only the rate of fire.

ACE wrote:

To touch up on an earlier subject. The voltage or type of battery doesn't determine the velocity or distance of the airsoft, but only the rate of fire.

exactly. thanks ace and spartan 1 for shining some knowlege on these people. that way they can stop wasting money on stuff they dont need.

ariel, what are you trying to say? because i sure as hell know that neither me nor anyone else was crying or not being a man about being shot in the face.

i talk about the lipos because its controls the rate of fire. it sucks to have to go to work bleeding from your face, it sucks more when the idiot shot you 20 times with one trigger pull cause of the damn lipo, not to mention that theyre gun shoots hot as hell..

and seriously, if you need that fps because "they wont call their hits" then how honorable can you guys be? that statement right there is proof that sfar is currently having big cheating problems....cause you aint gonna be changing your guns drastically for one cheater.

ok this has gone too far already there is no nor shall there ever be an fps rule at the reserve or the silo for that matter and further more i strongly disagree with what you said about us having cheating problems because that day that i had met you face to face at silo that same day seabee and myself had gun down some enemies in the tree line next to the road i had killed the same guy 8 !! times ! before he left the game he only called out twice i have also dealt with a team of 6 which would call out leave and then jump right back into the game with no re-spawns,spawn camping ,not following the 10 foot rule,shooting after out just to hurt someone so please jester if you dont like were we play, how we play and maybe even who we play with then with all do respect and by all means stay at the silo .

Do NOT take this as an offence.
just sick of the back and forth and its starting to seem heated already.

I dident say you were crying but all your talking about in every post is something about getting shot in the face. Again im saying if you dont want to get hit in the face or you wear a paintball mask or you just dont play cause either a 380 or a 450 fps gun when that bb hits your face your going to bleed if not its going to leave a mark no matter what and also if you do happen to get hit in the face all you can do is be a man about it thats not what im trying to say thats what i am saying.

And I cant let you sit here and say that we are having cheating problems at SFAR cause thats giving us a bad name and thats no where close to what we are about at all. People leave silo to come here cause of the cheating over there.

Now if you have a problem with the people and their guns that are at SFAR then i really think like zulu said stay at the Silo now remenber your always welcome to SFAR. Also i would like for you to come to SFAR so we can all talk in person so we can hear and address any of your concers cause sometimes mesages are misunderstood and misread

So hope to see you Jester this sunday and maybe we can address all your concers but please do not go around saying that we have Cheating problems in SFAR cause alot of people would not appreciate you saying that

no, my message isnt being read right. i said that because theyre using the cheating as a reason to make their guns shoot hot. if thats the case that you need to make everyone suffer for one person then the problem is that bad. thats what i was reffering to.

Ok..! Can everybody STOP whining and giving scientific explanation of the aerodynamics, physicts and what of the newton`s laws of motion apply to a flying BB...! We are not here to save the world IT`S JUST A GAME.....! This is becoming ridiculous.! This is about "Field Rules"

Thank you.

P.S: fps,Rof and distance. Are all units of measurement..!

When Chuck Norris does a pushup, he isn't lifting himself up, he's pushing the Earth down.

Zulu wrote:

hi jester yes i understand were your coming from i can agree to 380-410 including lipo that would be fair and understandable i thought you ment just 370 which if that was the case why the hell would people be spending 200 dollars on guns because with that fps we are better off going to sports authority and paying 80 bucks i just don't want to make this an argument because i already had it at silo.com and i have wanted to kill that d@#k head murdock for awhile but another reason why i think people use high fps is because they get sick of people getting shot with a 400 fps gun and not calling out so they up the power so that when you get shot you better call out or they just bring the pain some more so yes i agree sometimes its bull shit how strong the guns are i agree that its also bull shit how people don't call out and the number 1 way to fix that is by making it hurt anyway i understand were your coming from and it would help again not trying to fight you just expressing myself .

its true, its the #1 reason why people upgrade their guns.
i use a crappy g36 with a 8.4v
im surviving and have been, i know someone wit a m16 dmr.
6.01 inner barrel
kwc m16 dmr with 7mm gearbox
m150
high speed systema motor
large li-po battery
holo sightwith magnifier
shoots arount 26 bb per second
at around 470-510 fps

he hit someone at like 200 feet in the head and left the guy a crater lol
botom line is, when people upgrade their guns, it sure as hell isent to make it last longer, on the contrary it breaks faster. they upgrade to make people feel it.

XIII when we played this last week you and me. Did we have a problem were are guns were not enough to keep up with the other teams guns that were shooting way hotter then yours and mines? No right in between you and me we won that game without a problem so really no matter what gun they had if the person thats using it sucks the other team can still win and do damage.

I have a AK 47 Echo1 C.P.W and i hit someone from one side of the building to the other and that person had a little of blood like a little pimple and my gun is bone stock out the box. Guys its the reality of the sport you could get hurt and even if i was shooting with your gun XIII i still would hve cause the same damage and our guns are stock with no lipos

And maybe when people upgrate there guns is so they can shoot harder cause i know at some poit along the road im going to upgrate my gun also but we cant reallty tell people they cant play with there guns cause it shoots to hard so really we can argue all we want but the simple fact is there is nothing we can do about it. Its everyones choice to do as they please with there gun


And you see jester thats my point where mesages get understood wrong thats why i would like you to come out this weekend to talk in person about it

See Yall Sunday

Guys I think enough has been said concerning this topic. Lets just leave it where it is cause it's not going anywhere. Just a couple of irate old men on here Lets all play with whatever guns we have and little by little We all one day will be on the same FPS level so all is equal. It's kinda like BF2 the more you play the better weapons you unlock. So with time I am sure everyones weapons will get better.

As for saving the world, God can't even do it.

Thank you Nobody for stoping all this nonsense and winning..!

I LOVE BATTEL FIELD BAD COMPANY 2

Jackal wrote:

Thank you Nobody for stoping all this nonsense and winning..!

Jackal, you look cute in that costume

LOL

Is the ''bang rule'' in the fox hole too?

Alex wrote:

Is the ''bang rule'' in the fox hole too?

Yes, and anywhere you paly airsoft with a group of people, unless you are playing in your own yard with your friends and have no rules.

can somebody tell me where the field is?

Panziekiller wrote:

can somebody tell me where the field is?

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